Nkabinde admits using 'thumb sucked' dates over Mchunu-Mogotsi meeting

Chief of Staff Cedric Nkabinde admitted before Parliament’s ad hoc committee on Thursday that he was confused about the dates of meetings between Minister Senzo Mchunu and Brown Mogotsi.

He said dates in his sworn affidavit were “thumb-sucked dates” because his electronic devices had been confiscated.

Nkabinde told the committee that he could not be precise about when the meetings took place, saying he had relied on estimation when drafting his statement with the help of the evidence leaders.

“When I was consulted by the evidence leader, I was upfront with them that it is so unfortunate that I can’t be precise with dates because I don’t have information with me because of gadgets,” he said.

“Then I was advised to more or less think it could be when. So I made this reference based on that.”

The confusion centred on whether the first meeting between Mchunu and Mogotsi occurred in September or between October and November 2024.

Nkabinde initially stated that he had only received Mogotsi’s contact details from the minister before facilitating a meeting in October or November.

However, members pointed out contradictions with his own affidavit, in which he stated that Lieutenant General Nhlanhla Mkhwanazi had called him in September 2024 about Mogotsi and later sent him the businessman’s number.

MK Party MP Sibonelo Nomvalo told the committee that Nkabinde’s evidence was inconsistent.

“Mr Nkabinde says in his statement he was called by General Mkhwanazi in September 2024, who asked him about Brown Mogotsi. He said to the General he knew Mogotsi as someone close to the Minister,” said Nomvalo.

“Now he says he did not know Mogotsi until he was instructed by the Minister around October or November. There is a lot of contradiction that the witness is making.”

Nkabinde admitted that his affidavit could contain incorrect dates. “I apologise to the committee that it could be not a correct version because there was nothing assisting me in recollecting,” he said. 

He insisted that he had informed the evidence leaders of his uncertainty. He further explained that he believed the meeting between Mchunu and the under-fire North West businessman, Mogotsi happened before the September 30 trip to Lusikisiki.

“Guided by the call of General (KZN provincial police commissioner Nhlanhla) Mkhwanazi, if that date is correct, the meeting with Brown Mogotsi would have happened before that.”

However, the shifting timeline angered several MPs. EFF leader Julius Malema accused Nkabinde of misleading Parliament.

“We are being given thumb-sucked information here in front of the nation and we must accept that?” Malema asked.

“Because you are under oath. Some of these things are going to come across as being lies under oath. This information written here is not worth the paper it’s written on, because it’s thumb-sucked.”

Malema added that Nkabinde should withdraw the affidavit and draft a new one, saying, “You are deliberately misleading us. Once you start shifting it around, it’s no longer the original affidavit before us here.”

ANC MP Mdumiseni Ntuli pressed Nkabinde to explain why he chose to specify October and November in his statement.

“What makes you decide to place October and November?” Ntuli asked. Nkabinde said that he had been “guided to estimate” because he could not access his phone.

Ntuli then confirmed that, based on Nkabinde’s revised account, “the first meeting between the Minister and Mr Brown would have taken place before the 30th of September.”

ActionSA MP Dereleen James expressed frustration, questioning the value of continuing the testimony.

“You’ve given us a sworn statement. You have sworn this morning. You now come and say you have thumb-sucked dates,” she said. “Are we really meant to probe further on a statement that is not truthful?”

''We need to connect the dots, and when you're sitting there telling us it could have been two months prior or later, that is not even close,'' she said. 

MK Party’s David Skosana said he was disappointed that Nkabinde was unsure of his own statement.

“It is upon you, before you sign, that this is a true reflection of what was discussed with the consultation team,” he said. “You are supposed to read it. Because now we are speculating November, December.”

EFF MP Leigh-Ann Mathys warned that the contradictions amounted to perjury. “We must note that this is not just an oversight hearing ,it’s perjury,” she said.

“You even have attorneys, so it was deliberate. It also speaks to your credibility. You did an entire report about the IPID executive director. If you don’t pay attention to something between five paragraphs on dates, it’s intentional and it is perjury.”

Nkabinde maintained that he had been transparent with the evidence leaders about his uncertainty. “I was truthful and open,” he said.

“If there are discrepancies in dates, it’s because I had no help recollecting accurate information from my gadgets, which have not been returned to me for months.”

Despite his apology, several MPs insisted that the inconsistencies undermined the credibility of his testimony and the integrity of the committee’s work.

“We cannot rely on a misleading statement,” said Nomvalo. “Otherwise, we are turning this into a talk show.”

The EFF has since opened a perjury case against Nkabinde at the Cape Town Police station. 

hope.ntanzi@iol.co.za

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